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Clipboard <-> external programs?
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vze26m98
Posted 2012-01-06 6:35 PM (#15299)
Subject: Clipboard <-> external programs?



Member

Posts: 9

Location: GWB
Hi all-

Based on a search of the Forum, and a quick test-paste to Notepad, it seems as though reVisit maintains it's own clipboard?

Is data interchange with other programs done via module files, or is there some other way of getting (pattern) data in-and-out of reVisit?

Best, Charles
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CS_TBL
Posted 2012-01-06 8:38 PM (#15300 - in reply to #15299)
Subject: Re: Clipboard <-> external programs?



Expert

Posts: 512
500
Location: Netherlands
Afaik, the only interchangable bit in revisit is the XML data from the module archive. And even then, you'd need an XML importer *and* converter in another tool, to do something useful with it. What are your plans exactly?
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vze26m98
Posted 2012-01-07 3:47 AM (#15301 - in reply to #15300)
Subject: Re: Clipboard <-> external programs?



Member

Posts: 9

Location: GWB
CS_TBL - 2012-01-06 3:38 PM
What are your plans exactly?


Hi Maarten-

Well, it's always nice to automate some of the layout when you've got a lot of notes, or want to make some global change. I guess it's break out the Python!

Best wishes, Charles
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CS_TBL
Posted 2012-01-07 11:16 AM (#15302 - in reply to #15301)
Subject: Re: Clipboard <-> external programs?



Expert

Posts: 512
500
Location: Netherlands
I think it'd be a better idea to describe such ideas rather than hack 'm low-level into a tune using external tweaking, it may become a handy feature. And, sure: I could mention some global functionality, but I've put those on Chris' todo already.. What other global changes (for which you need block functions) would there be?
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vze26m98
Posted 2012-01-07 2:04 PM (#15303 - in reply to #15302)
Subject: Re: Clipboard <-> external programs?



Member

Posts: 9

Location: GWB
Hi Maarten-

Your point is a good one.

Although I'm certainly guilty of it on occasion, I try to avoid making "feature requests" because I think they hasten the transformation of an "innovation" into a "deliverable." There'll be a time when I'll share the results of my work with reVisit, and Chris (as well as others) can figure out how they might make use of it. I have no idea whether sound designers use trackers at all in their work. Or should.

But regardless, there will always be something someone needs that the developer can't get to, and if there's a request in my first post, it's for interoperability. Creating an OLE-compliant clipboard might be a bit much, but enabling an option to save un-zipped module files, or the contents of the reVisit clipboard might be more portable moves toward data sharing.

Best, Charles
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CS_TBL
Posted 2012-01-07 4:17 PM (#15304 - in reply to #15303)
Subject: Re: Clipboard <-> external programs?



Expert

Posts: 512
500
Location: Netherlands
Ah, screw that innovation/deliverable stuff.. just tell what's on your mind.. discussion is always good. I've been around here for about five years by now and have probably about 50 meter worth o' chatlogs with Chris. You can also pitch your ideas with me! Perhaps I know an alternative to get to the same thing, or: if I agree on its use, you'll have an extra ally in brib...8<.. talking that feature into reViSiT.. ^_^
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chrisnash
Posted 2012-01-08 2:31 AM (#15305 - in reply to #15304)
Subject: Re: Clipboard <-> external programs?



Developer

Posts: 746
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Location: England

I'm all for discussion, though I don't promise instant gratification - ultimately, I'll choose whatever I think's best for reViSiT. As Maarten will testify, many suggestions find their way into reViSiT, but I'm not afraid to veto others (usually giving my reasons). I'm only one person - and not always in the best position to decide what would work best in all scenarios - that's when a consensus is useful. And I could easily be overlooking more elegant ways to do things, or whole new directions I've never thought of. Bottomline: there's really no risk to voicing ideas - I'll only pick the ones I think are innovative myself!

Program interchange, for example, is something I'm already looking to improve, but there are obstacles. For example, I really wanted to do drag and drop of MIDI data between reViSiT and hosts, but most hosts have internal/proprietary clipboards. Still, my experiments suggest copying/dragging from reViSiT to some hosts might be possible, just not the other way round. Interchange of tracker data itself is even harder - there is no standard format or OLE type even for dumping into other trackers. However, it is already on my list to support clipboard and dragging selections as text, MIDI, and someday audio - for dragging into explorer or other programs. Each format, however, has it's own limitations:

text: do I export the text the user sees (e.g. volume XOR panning column) or everything (volume AND panning column)? 
MIDI: how do I manage the loss of information when converting from trackers to MIDI?
audio: the process of mixing-down more-or-less makes this a one-way process, limiting the musical editing opportunities in other programs.

File formats are similar - reViSiT's extended feature set makes it less useful to export to the golden oldies (MOD, IT, XM), and no universal tracker file format has yet been developed (it's something I've been meaning to chat about with TakTik - one of Renoise's developer). Promisingly, reViSiT appears to have set a bit of a trend with its use of zipped XML files, which is similar to how Renoise now does it, and means a Renoise<>reViSiT converter should be relatively simple (though there are still notable differences in the formats). The structure of each format is extensible and fairly open, so there's no reason why someone out there can't cobble one together themselves - and getting the Module.xml file out of reViSiT's .zip file is just a drag and drop operation on Windows XP or higher.

Anyway, I think we've highlighted an area where more discussion is needed  and where its useful to know, for example: What other programs/technologies/processes are being used? What interchange do they support? What formats/methods are needed?

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CS_TBL
Posted 2012-01-08 10:42 AM (#15306 - in reply to #15305)
Subject: Re: Clipboard <-> external programs?



Expert

Posts: 512
500
Location: Netherlands
vze26m98: what may also help is putting in some experience weight. E.g. if you're experienced with creating improv/jazz pieces in a tracker format then any suggestions from you related to that style may be more fruitful then when I do such suggestions - I'm more into traditional orchestral writing. So, it may be an idea to tell what your field of experience is..
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